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[KiwiBiggles]

AI Strafe Attack - Coastal Steamer
nb: Coastal Steamer 3do by Archie (ShipArchie mod)

[BETA] Kiwi's Coastal Attack Mod
Download link below 4.09 only

Hi all,

Screenies are of AI machine gun and cannon strafing coastal 'shipping'.  WIP project is an extension of tech help thread here, inspired by dpeters95:

https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/topic,19417.0.html

Have been testing three coastal shipping objects (Barge, Trawler & Steamer) in classic-modded 4.09m install over the weekend, and I'm pretty happy with how they play in the game.    The coastal 'ships' are car objects using a cloned car.class and 3do folders from the ShipPack 2 and ShipArchie mods by Archie, FC and Microwave (Barge and Steamer) or extracted from the stock game (Trawler).  Still to come is a camoflaged barge for tropical riverine scenarios. 

Objects move in game and are placed in the sea and on rivers with an 'advanced' FMB method.  Objects can be strafed and destroyed by AI (or by the player naturally) with machine guns and cannon.  They have ship icons in game.  Currently testing and adjusting armor values so that Barge can be attacked and destroyed by aircraft with rifle calibre machine guns, the Trawler with .50 calibre class machine guns, and the Steamer with 20mm class cannons.

Purpose of WIP thread is to encourage discussion by interested parties, to see if project can be improved with a view to releasing a [Beta] mod, or if there is a superior method of acheiving same result (for example by modifying existing 'ship' objects).  Other useful topics for discussion may involve armor values (which are in any case easily modified by the player) and effects (a longer duration fire and smoke effect would be useful) keeping in mind these objects have all the same parameters as other 'car' objects (e.g. trucks).

My plans with this project at this stage are to fine tune the armor values and prepare a tutorial/readme on how to employ objects in FMB and some effective attack methods in-game, taking into account what game engine and AI can and can't do with the objects, preparation of demo and test missions well under way.  Also working on a 'HQ Attack Mod' - strafing objects created using a clone of stationary.class and 3do folders of suitable buildings - so far have tested the HQ tent from the 'LAL Fortification Mod' to pretty good effect, considering adding tropical hut and airfield building.

Ideas and feedback welcome.  More to follow.

Cheers 
Kiwi



==============================================
13 November 2011 Update:
[BETA] Download 4.09 only:
==============================================

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=YH9SV6DN

Re: 4.101: As far as I know the classfiles will need to be redone in 4.101.  I don't have a 4.101 java environment to make a standalone 4.101 mod right now, sorry.

README:


===============================================
COASTAL ATTACK MOD incorporating HQ ATTACK MOD
===============================================

Copy and paste the entries below for:

1. technics.ini
2. stationary.ini
3. chiefs.ini

YOU MUST MAKE COPIES AND BACK-UPS OF YOUR THREE ORIGINAL FILES - FIRST!!! - SO YOU CAN EASILY RESTORE YOUR INSTALL IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE MOD.

IF YOU DON'T MAKE BACK-UPS - EXPECT SMALL CHILDREN TO POINT AT YOU IN THE STREET AND MAKE INAPPROPIATE GESTURES.  DON'T SAY I DIDN'T WARN YOU!!!


Add three test missions here:

IL-2 Sturmovik 1946/Missions/Single/GB/Coastal/...



Mod created in 4.09m classic modded with PLUTONIUM EFFECTS MOD, CY6 GTORDER MOD and CY6 NEW GATTACK PROFILE MOD (highly recommended all) and custom regiments (generic regiments in download though).  Your mileage may vary.

Missions created in 4.09m classic modded with LAL_Fortification Mod, LAL_Hangar Mod, Archie ShipPack mod, ShipPack2 mod and the Amphibious Assault Ship Pack.  Your mileage may vary.


ALSO TESTED IN UP2.01

NOTE: MOD NOT COMPATIBLE WITH 4.101 OR DBW AT THIS TIME, SORRY.


Read about the development of this mod in the thread from whence you downloaded it.  The mod is very simple in design, but uses somewhat advanced techniques to apply. 

Much of the info in the thread will prove useful for creating your own missions with these new objects, but also your existing ship and vehicle objects.

These objects are primarily designed to be strafed by the AI - something that was difficult to acheive previously. 

They are based on a truck object and have similar properties to trucks, although they will appear in your game as ships and HQ buildings.

External padlock works on all objects.

Internal padlock works on the building objects.  Internal padlock is not reliable for objects on water.

Your AI wingmen can be ordered to strafe the new objects via the command menu.  Ground Targets - Attack All is effective.

The objects count as destroyed ground targets and/or cars, and are 25 points.


Credits:
Asheshouse, FC, Archie, Flakiten and Microwave for the ship object 3do folders.
LAL_ROne for the buiding object 3do folders.
Oleg of course.
The SAS crew for hosting the forum.

Thanks for trying the mod, post any problems in the thread, and I'll try to help.
Cheers
KiwiBiggles

DISCLAIMER:
THIS MOD IS FOR FUN!!!
ENJOY IT FOR WHAT IT IS.
USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. 
IT MAY BE IMPROVED OR DEVELOPED IN THE FUTURE.
FEEL FREE TO PLAY AROUND WITH IT OR RE-RELEASE IT IN PART OR WHOLE. 
PLEASE JUST GIVE A FELLA A MENTION IN THE CREDITS!
PEACE OUT!

Useful linkies:

CY6 GTOrder Mod:
https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/topic,14035.0.html

CY6 AI Ground Attack Upgrade:
https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/topic,11230.0.html

Archie's Steamers:
https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/topic,13204.0.html

ShipPack2:
I have an earlier version installed, but this one is even better:
https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/topic,12978.0.html

Amphibious Assault Ship Pack:
https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/topic,7714.0.html

Plutonium Effects - absolutely awesome:
https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/topic,6631.0.html

Thanks everyone!
KB

[SAS~Malone]

looks great! will give it a go first chance, thanks, KB!

[HundertzehnGustav]

i am a bit confused...
That Cargo Ship right there...
-it is a Car (yes? no?)
-that can move on water and on rivers with advanced FMB methods (will read what that means)
-with a ship icon

Remaining questions:
after the mission, did the Beaufighter get credit for shooting a Car, or for sinking a ship?

I find it good that Planes can now strafe shipping, and sink ships.
I scratch my head: the objects are not used like ships, and need special tools to be used in FMB.

Looking at this with big interest!

[KiwiBiggles]

Hi HG,

the problem posed was that the AI can't be made to strafe ship objects with machine guns and cannons.  I'm no expert on ships in the game but Malone confirmed in the tech thread that it has been looked at extensively, and no solution is in the offing.

The idea started from the old trick of placing a stationary fuel truck inside another object to 'trick' the AI into strafing.  Had a bit of a play with it and was suprised to find stationary objects can easily be placed on the sea in FMB - a fuel truck at sea looks pretty funny I must say. 

Next step was to see if a stationary fuel truck could be given a different 3do folder so that it appeared as a 'barge' in game.  Worked pretty well given certain limitations of the game engine and AI, and trick also works for other 3do objects like buildings.  AI can be set to strafe the objects in the FMB, and can also be ordered to strafe them in game (I've found the Ground Targets - Attack All order from the command menu works pretty well).  Also had some success with internal padlock, although it's not entirely reliable.  Objects also count towards target objectives like Destroy Ground. 

Next step was to try the same method with a cloned example of the car.class java, and it worked just as well.  A barge 'sailing' around over land is just as hilarious as a fuel truck at sea, but there's an FMB technique that can be exploited to plot the waypoints for 'Car' objects (trucks and tanks etc) at sea and on rivers - it's easy to do and is just a trick to swap waypoints between ships and other objects in the .mis file.

The objects have all the same parameters as other 'cars' - which gives us some advantages (strafing) but also disdvantages (no wake, simple damage model, object doesn't sink).  The intention is to mix these objects in with existing ships in missions, to get the advantages of both.  I have to say I've really enjoyed the test missions I've been playing, in-game the coastal objects are a bunch of fun.  As to the disadvantages, we can consider that these are slow coastal boats and don't leave much of a wake anyway, and that for a strafed boat to 'blow-up' but not sink is not too bad a result realism-wise.  The armor values can be fine-tuned - and that effects the way the AI reacts to the objects - hopefully we can tune it so as to make the objects more interesting in game and not one-size-fits-all weapons wise (much how trucks and tanks are different in game).

Objects count as a 'Car Destroyed' for the player - which I really didn't find that much of an immersion killer after a couple of ops - and it doesn't really make much difference to the AI (which is real subject of the mod).  Again, the idea would be to mix the objects in a mission, with a bit of thought it can turn out quite well in game.

It turns out the coastal objects still can't be internally padlocked, and I don't know why that is given it's a 'car' object.  In testing I could internally padlock the objects most of the time on land, but not when I moved the waypoints to the water.  Something in the game engine I suppose.  Some stationary objects padlock ok on water though... odd.  Good news though, external padlock works fine for all the objects I tested, the AI attacked them thru the ground attack menu in my testing, and if you want to shoot 'em up your good self the coastal objects are all big enough to attack with mark one eyeball (on my monitor anyway 1080p).

One constraint is that when attacking a group of objects, I found the AI won't attack if it can't destroy each of the objects.  For example if there is just one Steamer in a group of Barges, AI with machine guns won't attack at all, not even the Barges which it can easily destroy.  It's simple enough to work around though with just some thoughtful mission planning or in-mission management - for example have some bombed up planes take out the Steamer in the FMB, and order your AI wingmen to strafe up the Barges once the Steamer is taken out.  Again, it's a mix-and-match approach.

It's a bit of an open question whether this is the best approach, or something better can be acheived with custom 'ship' objects to do a similar job.  Hopefully some ship experts can weigh in.  If this IS the best approach, I can give you guys the tip its plenty of fun in-game, which is the main thing!

Cheers
Kiwi

[HundertzehnGustav]

Thanks Kiwi...
I red the tech thread, and i was, like, really worried this would turn all our classic ocean going ships into cars.

I basicaly agree... coastal and River shipping is something special, and i like you approach it the way you do.
stinks that they are still cars.. but i dont shoot for points or "car kill counts".
no internal padlock... no biggie.
so they move, slowly... can they, where applicable, be given smoke effects? since they have no wake, the lack of smoke would not only be sad, but make a lateral attack even more difficult.

Bridges... are they low enough to pass under... if not... do they collide and explode?

An interesting subject!

[KiwiBiggles]

Hey HG

Thanks for your interest! 

They're completely separate objects, even with their own java, so they don't screw with any existing objects, cars or ships.  The idea is they're best used in conjunction with existing objects.

Funnel smoke?  Great idea - I must admit it hadn't occurred to me.    These objects have got their own cloned 3do folders, so the heir.him etc could easily be modified with a hook for a funnel smoke effect... (actually the hooks must already be there because they were proper ships before I started messin' with 'em :lol:) but... I don't know if the effect could be made to work with the cloned car.class java though?  I'd say it's beyond the scope of what I'm trying for at the moment, but if the basic objects are sound in principle it might be something that can be looked at later (by the experts though it would be way beyond what I can do!).  In a way, all the ship features could be achieved in theory I suppose - and we'd have 'ships' and maybe be back to square one? I love the idea though.  If it can't be done for a reasonable amount of work - it's not something that has stopped me enjoying the test missions.

The ideal solution would be to have the AI strafe the existing ships.  By all accounts it's been investigated in depth and is a no-go for now.  I had a quick look at some of the java classes I figure might be involved - I was completely lost in a couple of minutes.  This is more a quick 'n dirty fix - but hopefully with lots of fun factor!

The only proviso on that is that I don't know that the damage values on 'proper' ship object (clones) couldn't simply be fiddled to the point the AI will strafe them.  The reason I say that is if I set the armor value high enough on these coastal objects... the AI won't strafe - maybe it's the same thing?  That's why I'm hoping some ship guru's might look in on the thread, but I'm assuming it's already been ruled out?

Bridges - I'll check that out.  I wouldn't be surprised if the hit boxes collide and things blow up.  It would be cool if they would pass under bridges.  If not, personally I'd work around it in the mission builder.  Actually, one of the interesting things I noticed in testing is that you need to be watchful of line-of-sight too, let alone collision boxes.  I'm pretty sure that some of the weird AI behaviour we see in-game is because the AI loses line-of-sight to an object, and that other objects can 'block' one another to the AI.  It could be similar to some of the problems where internal padlock fails when an object passes behind the canopy frame.  Can't be entirely sure though, just something I noticed.

Thanks again for reading.
Kiwi

[Riptide_One]

Kiwi,

Attacking ships is one of my favorite things in IL-2. Your mod would be great for missions like the single handed, 50 Cal. only, attack on Japanese shipping in Tonolei Harbor done by Black Sheep John Bolt in October 1943.

Cheers,

Riptide

[Kopfdorfer]

Kiwi Biggles,
                This is a very interesting thread, and certainly poses the possibility of opening many cans of worms AI and code wise.
I hope it continues to be explored, as some of the problems that you refer to (and are dealing with solving) are entwined with some limitations of the original game structure.
I shall follow this with great interest.
Good Luck

Kopfdorfer

[KiwiBiggles]

Just realised the AI appears to always attack 'Car' objects along the long axis, as in the screenie above - this will be so as to do a good job of attacking truck convoys and the like presumably.  We'll want more variety than that from our coastal attacks, so I'll look at putting the 'stationary' coastal objects back into the mod.  I think they'll make for a more authentic looking attack in the game when mixed in with the 'Car' coastal objects and 'Ship' objects - variety is the spice of life, right! 

The 109 screenie in the tech help thread illustrates that the AI will attack 'stationary' objects from broadside, and I like how that looks when the action starts. 

That being the case, may as roll the HQ Attack Mod 'stationary' objects in too, and make it all one combined mod. I'll put the whole lot into the demo and test missions so guys can try it all out at once.

nb: My classic modded 4.09m game has CY6's very cool ground attack AI mods installed - I don't know how much difference that makes to the test results I see, but since this is my fave version to play at the moment, I'll just run with it, and see how it turns out for guys with different setups.

[LuseKofte]

This is great , all the littles holes in game getting fixed, I like 

[HundertzehnGustav]

Kiwi - do not be worried about comments and ideas flowing in:
they are nor requests but merely things cropping up in our heads:
you are in the process of opening new possibilities, and i think it is it is normal for Players to express their wishes and concerns, dreams and fears.
Its inn the concept stage, and a lot is possible, so people are getting their hopes up...

[jeanba]

Thank you kiwi, lot of possibilities for your mod