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[SAS~Poltava]

Looking GREAT! It is indeed a beautiful aircraft.

[SAS~Storebror]

Heinkel claimed a top speed at rated altitude of around 480 kph or 300 mph. Yet, foreign users claimed no more than 420-430 kph could be attained.

Hi Baron,

That sounds interesting. Do you have sources for this claim of 420-430 km/h from foreign users?
I'm asking since all sources I could find state that the B-0 reaches 490-500 km/h, the B-1 500-510 km/h and the B-2 510-520 km/h, each at rated altitude.
The 420-430 km/h sound exactly like the B-1's speed at sea level, but if that was what it was able to reach at rated altitude, then the plane would likely have been returned to Heinkel immediately.

One more evidence for the top speed being in the 500 km/h's range is that in April 1937 Yugoslavia intended to buy 30 He-112B-1's, provided that Heinkel could guarantee that each plane could reach 500 km/h fully armed with 100% fuel.
This was right on the edge of the B-1's flight envelope and the deal was too risky for Heinkel, so he wanted to put the new Jumo 210G engine with fuel injection in (like on the B-2), which would guarantee that the plane could reach 500 km/h in any case at rated altitude (!).
The problem was that the RLM didn't allow the 210G engine to be exported at that time.
The permission wasn't granted before August 1938, but at that time the british aircraft manufacturers already conquered the yugoslavian airplane market.
Looked at the opposite way, this means that the He-112 was capable to reach speeds at about 500 km/h, in detail the B-1 was more or less exactly on that spot and the B-2 was safely above that margin, otherwise the whole deal's process would not have taken place at all.

Best regards - Mike

[BaronFel181]

Hi Storebror,

My source information comes from the "He-112 in action" book. The only real quantitative evidence of a speed discrepancy is Hungary's claim that they could not fly the He-112B-1 (Jumo 210E) beyond 267 mph (430 kph). No test flight altitudes are provided.

Also, a Romanian combat report (of August 1941) claims: "low horizontal speed, insufficient climbing capacity, and lack of maneuverability compared to the modern aircraft encountered". A country which operated both B-1s and B-2s

*Edit: I think Bf-109C/D's would have probably received a similar report of their performance on the Eastern Front

Lastly, a Spanish squadron (February 1939), flying both Jumo Bf-109s and He-112B's, remarked about the 109's greater power to weight ratio and maneuverability.

So, the evidence for the He-112B being unable to reach 300 mph is rather thin. But, I thought I'd bring it up anyway. You have more information than me, so I look forward to your FM modeled on Heinkel's flight data. Thanks for your thorough post and I apologize for overstating my evidence.

Baron

[SAS~Storebror]

Hi Baron,

Thank you very much for the reply.
Squadron & Signals He 112 in action (Aircraft Number 159) - right, I have the book but didn't stumble upon that chapter.
Hard to tell what made the Hungarians clock the He-112B-1/U2's top speed at 430km/h only.
This should have been noted elsewhere (Rechlin, Spain, German short time usage of the 112, Rumania, ...) but this claim can be found in that single line from the Hungarian tests only.

Concerning the 109's greater p/w ration and the 112's deficiencies compared to mid 41 aircraft I think that we're all on the same page

Best regards - Mike

[Knochenlutscher]

I have Hungarian Fighter Colours Vol. 1+2 MMP Books.
When at home I can look it up at the respective Chapter for you Mike.
Tobias

[101tfs]

early mark please

[spartan18a]

I wanna help a little bit in this issue.
Spain had some of these aircraft and created a squadron in 1939 with them: Escuadrilla 1E-5 grupo mixto 5G-5 (Muñoz Jiménez-Millás / García Pardo)
http://www.aviationcorner.net/gallery.asp?aircraft_type=Heinkel%20He-112&aircraft_type_id=1589&set_lang=true






I´ve been doing some research and asking some people and I have found this magazine published by the Spanish Airforce: Revista Aeroplano nº11. There is an article about the He112 in the Spanish Airforce pages 134-138

http://www.ejercitodelaire.mde.es/ea/pag?idDoc=9D18D26FF9A0FAA3C125770A00300C15
http://www.ejercitodelaire.mde.es/ea/pag?idDoc=F737794CD9B11B13C12577050034837C

I am going to read it to see if I find sth about the FM or opinion about this aircraft's performance .... Well, I have read it but unfortunately it does not say anything about its performance. Most of them had accidents for many different reasons, especially the lack of replacing pieces. It fought at the end of the Spanish Civil War against I15 and I16 and the incident involving 11 P38s crossing the Spanish territories in North Africa.
http://www.pegatiros.com/03_mundomilitar_repor_0024_aviacion_heinkel-he-112.php

[SAS~Poltava]

Perhaps it's this aircraft being a bit of a disappointment that prompted the Romanians to use it mainly as a strafer, attacking ground targets? Which seems pretty crazy if it actually had been a top notch interceptor performance-wise.

[SAS~Storebror]

early mark please

Like this one?


I don't know what the "Cockpit -> he100 / he112" remark should tell me.
If there's something left to be change, please specify.

Best regards - Mike

[HotelAlpha]

The He 112 in Spain was one of the airplanes that flew until it could no longer; the last one (in the world, for that matter) was sent to the scrap yard in 1953. The airplane was alright to fly but was not nearly as fast as the Bf 109s that Spain had at that time by 60 or so Km/H. This all goes back to the rather stupid installation of a Jumo 210 into the aircraft, rather than a real fighter engine, like a DB 601 at least.

[Knochenlutscher]

No luck in the MMP book Vol.2 He-112. No mention of data received from
the trials of the Hungarian trio Heinkels.
Though the same author as the Squadron Signl Publication, Dénes Bernád.

Found this in a polish publication
Wydanictwo Militaria, Seweryn Fleischer, #164, Heinkel 112


Points to several german books in the Bibliography chapter. But these I don't have, too old.

Tobias

[SAS~Storebror]

Thanks Tobias, the figures match the ones I have in my books, slightly below 500km/h for the B-0 (which is very similar to the V-9), 500 for the B-1 and ~510 for the B-2, that's what I've tuned the FMs to as well.

Best regards - Mike